Podcast Alert: Drew Weatherford – Weatherford Capital

Transcript

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Drew Weatherford: [00:00:00] There are 7.5 million kids that would love to go play at a school, even if it’s on their, second-tier team. I think that’s another way for athletic departments to do something that is, hiding in plain sight, and it’s good for everyone involved.  

AJ Maestas: Hello, and welcome to the Navigating Sports Business Podcast. I’m your host, AJ Maestas, founder of Navigate, a data-driven consulting firm guiding major strategies and decisions in sports and entertainment. We started this podcast hoping to share the interesting stories and experiences of the amazing people we get to work with at Navigate. 

And even though they’re visionaries and famous in many instances, their true stories aren’t often heard since they’re not on the playing field. Our hope is you get to know them better and learn from them as we have. [00:01:00] Today, I’m happy to be joined by Drew Weatherford, former Florida State quarterback and founding partner at Weatherford Capital, and he’s got his hands all over the collegiate space, and in particular, potential investments with athletic departments. So really grateful for you to join today, Drew. Thank you for being here. 

Drew Weatherford: AJ, great to be with you. Been a fan for a long time, especially with all the great work that you’ve done for my alma mater over the last several years during a pretty interesting time. I’m so honored to be on the show with you and, look forward to the conversation. 

AJ Maestas: Ooh, I love compliments, so I’ll take that. No, I’m actually lying, but the truth is, I would love to talk about Florida State. So yeah, cause I see all kinds of, paraphernalia behind you, so I love it. You’re still a proud Seminole, yeah? 

Drew Weatherford: Yeah. Yeah. Shaped who I was. I grew up a big fan when I was a kid. I’ll never forget, Coach Bowden came and spoke at my church when I think I was eight years old, [00:02:00] and I was born in ’85, so I was kinda born, right at the beginning of their run. And it was a pretty easy team to like. Not only because of the coach, who is an incredible human being. They don’t make them like him anymore. But also just they were a fun team to watch. They were really good. 

I think they were in the top five for 14 straight years in a row. So it’s quite a dream come true to be able to actually go play at FSU, and, I’ll never forget it and forever be grateful. 

AJ Maestas: Are there any of those moments from your playing days that, really stand out to you? 

Drew Weatherford: There are a few. The first one was actually just having Coach Bowden in my home. He was notorious for Being really good when he got in the living room and being able to close parents and student athletes. And frankly, it felt like having a family member over. I’ll just never forget. I’m from this huge family. 

There’s seven boys, two girls. So dinner, big dinner table. I think it was pretty surreal [00:03:00] to just have him in my home around the table. And frankly, the way he made everyone feel. I don’t think we talked about football once. And he left and it was kind of a done deal. So he lived up to his reputation. It just felt right. And, he was an honor. He was an honor to play for, that’s for sure. 

AJ Maestas: Now, were you a big-time recruit? Because I have heard stories about him just seamlessly fitting in with a Southern family and things like that. So was he fighting to win your commitment? 

Drew Weatherford: He was, yeah. I was fortunate to have some older brothers that played before me, which was great. So I got a sense of what good looked like and what hard work looked like. And so they paved the way for me. But I was really one of the first big recruits to ever come out of my high school to be as highly touted as I was coming out of high school. I grew up in a kind of a small town north of Tampa, Pasco County. 

I went to a small high school called Land O’Lakes High School, which up [00:04:00] until that point, there was actually my receiver who was a year older than me, which I’d like to think I had… He was an incredible athlete, but we both helped each other get to where we ended up. But he went to the University of Minnesota, and then I went to FSU right after that. 

And then to be honest, there were just a lot of athletes that kick- started coming out of that school. And I’m a big believer in you sometimes you have to see things in order to really know what it means to be good or to be great. And once it’s your choice of whether you’re gonna work that hard or not. 

And so it was cool to see what happened. But I started as a freshman in high school, which is unique. My older brother was on my team. My first completion from line of scrimmage was to my brother Sam. And I was a top five quarterback coming out of high school. I was an Elite 11 kid, and so was able to go out to California with Bob Johnson and all those guys, and it was like me and Rhett Bomar and Cornelius Ingram, who ended up playing tight end at the [00:05:00] University of Florida. 

He was a pretty freaky athlete. And so yeah, I was offered as a sophomore by, my first offer was from Auburn. And it’s funny how it works. It’s once you get the first big offer, they all start rolling in. And that first offer really came, I was pretty unknown at that time, and I just went to camp and had a great camp. 

And there were some big recruits there that they were paying a lot of attention to. And I just, I balled out, and people were like, “Oh my goodness, who is this kid?” Offered me kinda before I left, and then it wasn’t 30 days later that most every other power forward program kind of followed behind, behind suit. So it was a pretty, pretty fun experience in high school, for sure. 

AJ Maestas: Do you think you’re, do you think you’re attending Florida State if it’s 2025 when there’s NIL involved and let’s say Bobby Bowden’s retired? 

Drew Weatherford: Yeah. It’s a really good question. I don’t know. As loyal as I was, and, [00:06:00] and it was a big dream of mine, if there was real money involved and Ohio State, for example, or Michigan or someone else, I like to think that I would’ve still gone there, but I can’t say for certain that would’ve been the case, which is interesting to think about. 

It’s interesting. It’s just become such, it’s so much more of a business today than it used to be. I actually had some mentors of mine that played at FSU that told me when I was coming out that I shouldn’t go there. 

AJ Maestas: Really? Why? What was the reason? 

Drew Weatherford: It was frankly where Coach Bowden was in his career. I graduated in 2008. He retired in 2010. So it was on the back end of his career, and the offensive coordinator was his son, and they weren’t convinced that he was the right guy for the job. Mark Richt, who was at Florida State, had gone to Georgia, and so they really wanted me to go to [00:07:00] Georgia, to go play for the guy they played for. So I’ll leave those individuals. 

AJ Maestas: I was just gonna say, give me that list. I’m taking that to Michael Alford. 

Drew Weatherford: I’m naming names. But, it was a very emotional decision for me. I think most kids now make way more practical decisions. Who’s the offensive coordinator? What’s the offensive line look like? 

What does the receiving corps look like? Where Florida State during that time was like, they were the Alabama, and you just assumed they were always going to be great. And you just assumed the offensive coordinator was going to be great cause they had been great for so long. And I actually just, I kinda got there at an interesting time. Things were a little unstable when I arrived. 

AJ Maestas: Did anybody make any offers that didn’t fit with NCAA rules at that time? If you’re a top five recruit, people had to be offering money, jobs. 

Drew Weatherford: Yes. They did. Not as frequently as you would have thought for a couple reasons. I think, one, everyone knew that I was so [00:08:00] likely to go to FSU cause I was a fan for so long. And even, and honestly, even though I came from pretty humble beginnings, frankly, I think because of the way I looked, they didn’t think I necessarily needed it, if that makes sense. Interesting. Huh. Being a white kid from like a suburban area. There’s nine kids in my family, right? 

We did not have much money. So we were, I would go as far to say we were poor when I was young, and we were like lower middle class when I was in high school and in middle school. But I think I had brothers that played in college before me, and so I think it was a combination of factors that I didn’t get a lot thrown at me before, and frankly, I didn’t get a lot thrown at me while I was at school, interestingly enough. 

And I don’t know if it was just I put off a vibe like I didn’t need it or didn’t want it, or because I was a, I’d like to pride myself on being like a [00:09:00] high character, high integrity person, that people wouldn’t come at me with it. Not to say that I didn’t get a free beer while I was in school, ’cause that happened, right? 

Every once in a while, I’d show up to … I’ll never forget showing up to, Mo’s, the little burrito shop, and the guy there would be, like, trying to give me food, and I’m like, “No, I wanna pay for the food.” He’s ” no, just take it.” I’m like, “No, I wanna pay for the food,” but there’s like people in line. 

It’s awkward. Yeah. And then you’re just like, “All right. I’m gonna take my Mo’s burrito and just go eat so I don’t make a scene.” But other than that, seriously, other than that, which I think is a bit unique, I think most people that were as highly recruited as I was dealt a lot more with it. I didn’t, interestingly enough. So my how the world has changed. 

AJ Maestas: Yeah, no doubt. I have some stories from southeastern part of the country and different era with a couple of guys who are willing to talk about when they go to a different school and, yeah, I’m really [00:10:00] surprised. But that’s a real positive thing, right? 

And I can understand being a big fan of Bobby Bowden and wanting to follow even if he was at the end of his career. What a run, what a character. You could say he built that athletic department in many ways, right? Or- Not, yeah, funded department. I mean- Yeah. Yeah, the success. 

Drew Weatherford: I would say that was like I think one of the first case studies around a football program becoming great and then therefore a university following behind. 

AJ Maestas: Yeah. Yeah. 

Drew Weatherford: So most people in the FSU Seminole nation would accredit him to being as much of a part of the university growing to where we are today, which we’re a top 20 public institution, which is wild. That was not- we weren’t even close to that when he started or frankly or even when I got there, in 2004. But that played a big role in that for sure. 

AJ Maestas: Yeah. Yeah. There’s no question. It’s having worked with Florida State it’s [00:11:00] actually refreshing that there’s a singular focus. It’s very clear The expectations are to compete and grow at the highest level. That’s academically, the progress of the university, applications, enrollment, on-field success. 

A lot of universities deal, especially now with all the changes, this sort of push and pull of where they should be and where their priorities should be. So yeah, it’s, I think it’s a positive for Florida State. It’s very clear. 

Drew Weatherford: We have some great- Good point … we have some great leadership from our president McCullough to our chairman Peter Collins, to our athletic director, AD Alford, and a very supportive board. What’s unique about us is I believe everyone but one person graduated from FSU that’s on our board. I’m not– And that was just recently. For a long time since I’ve been on the board, literally every person on our board was actually a graduate from the institution, and that’s not always the case. 

AJ Maestas: Yeah. It’s been really good, honestly, working with them, and y- you could even go further down the executive ranks. Your general counsel- Karen … she went to Florida State. Rock star. But people [00:12:00] care. That’s right. Yeah, like people care, which is, it’s a difference maker for sure. So you humble beginnings. Family doesn’t have a lot of money. Is it a coincidence here that you and your brother are in private equity? 

Drew Weatherford: Yeah, I, actually, yes. I didn’t grow up knowing what private equity was. My, my father was a commercial real estate broker, and my mom homeschooled us. So she was a stay-at-home mom. She homeschooled for 25 years. It’s funny. I feel like as she got more and more worn down, we went to school earlier and earlier. 

My eldest, the oldest in our family is a girl, she was homeschooled all the way through high school. My brothers were homeschooled up until high school, and they started going. And then I think I was the first one to start going. I’m number four of nine. I was the first one to start going in, middle school, so it’s kinda like slowly but surely. 

But she put in a lot of work, and, we were very fortunate to just be raised by just wonderful parents who really cared about each of us individually and kept [00:13:00] things pretty simple. Just the importance of being high character, high integrity, hardworking individuals was paramount. My, my dad would literally every d- every time he’d drop us off for school, he’d ask us a question which we would roll our eyes about, which is like, “Hey, what does God expect of you today?” 

Oh, and it’s from the Book of Micah, and it’s to be as simple as to be humble, to be kind, and to be just. And I would say those were the core emphasis of the way we were raised. And, yeah, so I, I didn’t know what I wanted to do, AJ, after school. I didn’t think I knew I was gonna play for a long time, which I obviously did not. 

I started as a freshman in high school. I started as a freshman in college, red shirt freshman. Played my sophomore year, my junior year, got hurt going into my senior year, and honestly, everything just changed pretty drastic. I did not Play my senior year, which is probably the first moment [00:14:00] when it became clear to me that I was not playing amateur sports, that I was playing professional sports, was the reasons behind the decision that was made had nothing to do with wins and losses that year. It had to do with a bigger narrative. 

AJ Maestas: What was that? I don’t know the history. 

Drew Weatherford: So Bobby’s late in his career. We had just made someone our, head coach in waiting, which was our offensive coordinator. Our offensive coordinator, when you think about those dynamics, I’m not a big fan of, head coaches in waiting. 

When you think about it, there’s a lack of alignment ’cause what really matters, like winning today or winning tomorrow. And those are two different answers oftentimes. So there were some decisions made that didn’t just affect me, but affected a lot of guys on the team. There was a lot of older receivers and running backs, et cetera, et cetera, that got less playing time [00:15:00] than they otherwise would. 

Why? Other guys, would get experience, and frankly, those losses were not on the head coach in waiting’s head. Those losses were on Bobby’s head, and so it accelerated, I think, him being gone ultimately. And so I went from starting three years in a row to not really playing at all my senior year. 

And there was never a clear explanation as to why to scouts, to agents, cause what does someone say in that situation? Especially when the guy who did play, who’s a good, dear friend of mine, Christian Ponder, played as a sophomore. He ended up obviously being good enough to play in the NFL, but he wasn’t his sophomore year. 

So what do coaches say to scouts and to GMs and to agents when the guy who did play wasn’t good enough to play in [00:16:00] the NFL, and then you have a senior that’s sitting on the bench? Like, how do you really explain that? So I don’t blame the coach necessarily cause he made a business decision at the end of the day that I do think was, helpful to him and his agenda, but it definitely had negative consequences for me going into the draft. 

So I ended up not being invited to the Combine. Had a really great pro day, got picked up as an unsigned free agent to Chicago, played really well, definitely thought I was gonna stick, and I just didn’t. And I think a big reason why was the guy didn’t play last year. How do you keep someone who didn’t play? 

And they tried to blame my injury, but the truth was me, I like hurt my knee during spring practice, and I was 100% healthy to play during the season. There were just other motives at play. So that was hard. It was a really hard thing to [00:17:00] grapple with. I was kinda faced with the decision of, like, how do you handle that situation? 

And I’d like to think I chose the high road and was a good teammate and was on the sideline giving signals and stuff , trying to be supportive, having faith that my opportunity would come during the season. And the truth is, it never really came. I’ll never forget the third game of the season. We’re playing Wake Forest, and I believe there were five… 

You’ll have to check the stats here. I believe there were four or five interceptions thrown that game. Oh, man and I still never got in the game. 

AJ Maestas: Did you win? Did Florida State win? 

Drew Weatherford: No, we didn’t. I don’t think- and, so there was… It didn’t make sense. If you let me go in and I play well, it’s… they’re gonna have a really hard time not playing me the next week. And- So it’s interesting. The only game that I ended up playing in was at the end of the season. We’re playing Florida in the rain, and we’re down by, I think two, maybe three touchdowns. [00:18:00] Our guy gets banged up. He comes over to me and says, “Hey, do you wanna go in?” 

I think he’s gonna say no. He thinks I’m gonna say no. And I’m like, “Hell yeah.” “I’m ready to go.” “Of course I’m gonna go in and try to play.” But at that point it was like his guy got experience. Heck, if we beat Florida, great. Maybe I have to play in the bowl game. But at the end of the day it was like mission accomplished. 

AJ Maestas: If you were to make a bet, take the, take a portfolio of people without backgrounds in college athletics that become athletic directors, you think five, 10 years from now we look back and say, “That was a success. They helped us get college athletics into the future and leap forward,” or will we look back and say, “Oh, that had a lower than average success rate because of , the, the institutional knowledge adapting to the college space was just too difficult”? What’s your prediction on pro sports people running athletic departments? 

Drew Weatherford: First of all, I think that there will be… It won’t be all of the ADs, but let’s call it 50% of them will have a [00:19:00] non-traditional background- in the future. That’s my prediction, that at least 50%. I think it’ll be a trend for a while, and then we’ll have to see how does it all play out at the end of the day. 

I do get the sense, and I’m sure you do as well, all of these schools are becoming a little more entrepreneurial about the way that they’re thinking about athletics, right? I mean- Yeah, some a lot … it’s slow. Some a lot, some a little. For sure, and it’s moving slow, but these are conversations they would have never entered. 

Private capital and college sports never entertained. They would never– Creating an LLC to potentially put your athletics department in a for-profit entity, whether they do or they don’t, the fact that they’re just forming these LLCs is fascinating. Vertically integrating MMR, no one ever thought about that 10 years ago. 

Now there’s a lot of people talking about that. So I think because of that, there will absolutely be a huge [00:20:00] influx of professional sports operators that put their name in the hat and that win jobs. I do believe that will be a, that will be a trend. Do they make it or not? Yeah, can they navigate the complexity of a university system and just the dynamics? 

We’ll see. We’ll see. I think it’s gonna be fascinating to watch, and I do think we’re gonna get to watch it, cause I do think they’re gonna end up– there’s gonna be plenty of people like Rob, who’s a non-traditional, I think, candidate at USF, not running a professional sports franchise, but not running an athletic department or growing up in an athletic department either. 

I think we’ll see more of it, and, I’m optimistic. I’m optimistic to, to see the type of, value they can create. And the reason why, AJ, is right now there’s like this echo chamber in college sports. It’s, they all do things the same way. [00:21:00] They all listen to each other. They go to the same conferences. 

And under any circumstance in any industry, that’s not a good thing. Diversity of thought and experience is a good thing, generally always. And right now you just don’t have it. You just don’t have that AD that’s taking that chance that’s paying off and then people following in their footsteps, right? 

Everyone’s got a really sweet gig. I think being an athletic director at a big school is one of the coolest jobs there is. 

AJ Maestas: Really? Okay, I’m so sorry to interrupt you, but I look at it and I think this is awful. It’s just the politics and they get paid worse than a president of a pro sports team while managing 20 sports instead of one. 

And they have students, staff, faculty, politicians, taxpayers. There’s so many stakeholders. But, it used to be my dream job, by the way, so I’m contradicting even my own- Yeah … opinion in the past. [00:22:00] You think it’s an awesome job. I think it’s a terrible job. Help me understand why it’s a great job. 

Drew Weatherford: I think it’s an incredible job. Yes, there is some added complexity, because of the am- number of sports that you have to deal with, that you have to deal with academics, and you have to deal with the university But also, you outsource a lot of that job too, right? They leverage a lot of vendors to actually run their business. 

So yes, there’s an operational component 100%, and it’s a hard job. I’m not saying it’s not a hard job, but it’s a really cool job. And frankly, all of the change makes it more cool and more fun and more of a challenge, and I think creates more opportunity. Without all of this disruption, it would be a pretty run-of-the-mill job where you just kinda keep the trains moving on time. 

I think real entrepreneurs will be attracted to this new [00:23:00] environment because of the change, because that’s what creates opportunity. That’s how you differentiate yourself is in these moments in time. Hence why there’s professional people interested in these jobs. There are a lot of people that are non-traditional candidates more than ever that I think are interested in college sports. 

They pay pretty well. It’s not like these guys aren’t making money. They’re making- they’re making decent. They’re making, not decent, they’re making really good money. 

AJ Maestas: That’s a good segue to private equity then, ’cause one of the first things that comes up when people talk about this is governance and reporting structure, and is there a board, and what is the accountability, and are you gonna privatize athletics? 

And I know one of the things your firm is doing is considering investing in athletic departments, but I do agree, there’s too much on their plate. There isn’t executive level support. If I could take one parting punch at the, non-traditional hires. And by the way, ironically, we’re always pushing people to look to the pro space in best practices. 

We’re absolutely pushing people [00:24:00] to be progressive and innovative and accept the risks of mistake and what have you. But it just happens to be in the last couple weeks here, I’ve, talked with, Dave Brandon, who was the athletic director at, uh, Michigan, chairman of the board, a big, large public company, major donor, board of the university, very savvy, intelligent individual. 

And it didn’t work out at Michigan. Or Steve, I’m trying to think of, like, how many… I’m looking back in the rearview mirror here and thinking about pro sports people, yeah, that, came into the college space. There have been these stories of, and maybe it’s different now, ’cause they, now they need that rate of change, but there’s these consistent stories of not failing ’cause what they were doing was wrong, but just the system being uncomfortable with it. They didn’t have the reps. 

Drew Weatherford: Pay attention to who you’re actually putting on the boards, if they’re in it for the right reasons. I also think I’m a big proponent, too, because running the university is a big job, and being a board of trustees member is a [00:25:00] big responsibility, and that’s 90% of what we focus on is the university, right? 

10% of it is athletics. That doesn’t mean that the value of it is the same. I’m just saying the amount of time we spend on athletics compared to everything else is probably 90/10. But that 10% is an extremely valuable piece of the overall enterprise of the university. It should be run, and I think governed, differently and by different people than the board of trustees. 

I’m a big proponent of having a separate committee that sits over athletics for a lot of different reasons. But there should be, say it’s a board of five or seven, there should be boards of trustees members, the most capable that understand what’s going on, that should sit on that committee. Just like any other committee. 

I sit on the student affairs committee. I sit on the finance committee at FSU. I could also sit [00:26:00] athlete- athletic department committee, with a few other of my colleagues and have some real professionals also sit there. I think it’s good for the coaches, I think it’s good for the AD to have a buffer between you and just all the other board members that wanna be involved in athletics that don’t really know anything. 

Like right now, it’s like open season, like anyone can reach out to the AD whenever they want. I don’t think that’s very healthy. So I don’t know if you’ve talked to any of your clients about that, but I would be very interested to get your opinion of a governance model like that and the pros and cons. 

AJ Maestas: I couldn’t agree more. People move towards incentives, even if they don’t perfectly fit those incentives. And it makes so much sense. I can even give you some examples. It’s- You never wanna understate the power of Phil Knight and his influence with Oregon. But, there are some key board members there that made the effort to separate the flagship state university research institution from everything from community [00:27:00] colleges to other four-year colleges around the state. 

So now Oregon has a board that is just concerned with the University of Oregon, and if you look at it, you could peek online right now and you would see people who went to school there, just as you described for Florida State, who care about the place, have a long-term sort of vested interest to have done some pretty impressive things, and the very diverse perspectives and background, but all with one heck of a incentive and motivation to see what’s best for that university. 

And there’s still a lot of states out there where that board is serving over all of higher education in the state. And, but I would go even further than even you just mentioned, and I hopefully you don’t disagree with this, given you’re in the private equity world, but where are the compensation structures? 

In any other, to your point, any other 200 million a year business that’s highly complex with a lot of pressure, where you’re working two to 250 nights a year and it’s a lifestyle job, you have an equity incentive, and there’s a reason to create value. And that really offsets, and, it allows you to take those slings and arrows on day-to-day policy, which you hear from everybody cause you’re [00:28:00] working for the taxpayers in a public in- institution, to, to reach for greatness. 

It’s not what we see. We track sort of growth rates across different revenue categories, across college athletics overall. College athletics, the big universities, not just all of them, ’cause the big ones are doing better than the small ones. Big universities in athletics are growing at half the annual compound growth rate of, the better-run pro sports leagues. 

And then you say, ” why?” They’re more popular, of course, right? So when you proportionately look at how popular college athletics is, and I’m talking about major conferences and what have you, they are actually getting just over 50 cents on the dollar, relative to their fandom, fan interest, passion, loyalty. 

It’s a mixed metric that we put together. So that’s just to be simple about it with the math. But you’re getting 50 cents on the dollar and growing at half the rate, not closing the gap, is what you’d assume. Yeah, I agree on governance. I think it’s a big factor in, in high-functioning businesses and athletic departments and universities. 

The risk aversion, which we all talk about endlessly in these kind of [00:29:00] conversations, where is the incentive structure to do otherwise? What would allow one to reach for- And I know you say they get paid well, and we know they get paid well compared to history. But again, you go to the pros, just like college coaching versus pro coaching, you go to the pro sports world and you’ll have half as many busy nights, half as many events… 

No, not half, one-tenth as many events that you should be at or should attend with better support and better compensation. So what’s that deal? And they w- why would two equally capable executives choose those paths? You’d be like, “You’re crazy. Why, what are you doing college for?” 

Drew Weatherford: Yeah, no. I think you’re, I think you’re right, and something’s gotta change there. I also think on the other end of the spectrum, so you talk about professional sports and how they’re out-earning, and outgrowing college sports. I also think on the other end of the spectrum, which is an interesting place to look, you look at IMG Academy, a wildly- profitable, basically big athletic department, right? 

With 16 sports. They have 16 different sports. But they also have [00:30:00] multiple teams in each sport. And so I’m not sure how much you paid attention to this, add more athletes thing grassroots. 

AJ Maestas: Can I interrupt you for full disclosure? You’re on the board of IMG Academy, right? 

Drew Weatherford: I am. Yeah. Yeah. I’m on the board, but the only reason why that- It’s as close to getting to an athletic department as there is on the planet. Yeah. Sixteen hundred- Good … it’s actually bigger. There’s 1,600, so it’s three or four times as big as most athletic departments, and they’re not cash flow break even, I’ll put it that way. 

They’re- So they- they’re a wildly profitable- Sold for- … business that sold for $1.2 billion and will sell for a lot more than that several years from now. 

AJ Maestas: You think so? ‘Cause it, ’cause the tr- growth trajectory. ‘Cause I heard the EBITDA multiple was over 20. It was an incredible premium. 

Drew Weatherford: I’m not gonna speak to valuation. It’s gonna be a great outcome for everybody. So I’m on the board, and we’re also invested in it. It’s gonna be a great outcome for everybody involved. But if you look in athletic department, [00:31:00] they have hundreds of millions of dollars of facilities in place, and they have one team. And is there a way to actually think about– I know this is completely opposite of what you guys focus on, but is there a way to actually enterprise and commercialize sport at the bottom end of the market too? 

Parents have been paying for their kids’ youth sports education a lot of money since they’re 10 years old. Then all of a sudden you get to university, and it’s basically intramurals or NCAA-sanctioned sports. Is there not a club sports model where you can leverage your existing infrastructure to generate, real money on top of those facilities? 

I think the answer is yes, and I actually think there’s two ways of doing it. One is us all collectively advocating that the NCAA change the rule around not being able to play in multi-divisional play in the same sport. [00:32:00] FSU can’t have a softball team D1 and then a D2 softball team. Why? That doesn’t make any sense. 

There are eight million student-athletes every year that graduate high school that play sports, and there’s only five hundred thousand roster spots. There are seven point, point five million kids that would love to go play at a school, even if it’s on their, second-tier team. And guess what? Yeah. 

Their parents would pay for it too. They’d be full tuition paying, great grades. You wouldn’t have to make exceptions for them on a grade point average ’cause there’s so many of them if you wanted to keep the standards high. And guess what? Their parents would actually pay. They’d just keep paying what they’ve been paying their whole lives, which is tens of thousands of dollars for them to actually get coached and to grow as an individual. 

I think that’s another way for athletic departments to do something that is hiding in plain sight, and it’s good for everyone involved. Coaches [00:33:00] get a chance to have a farm system, basically. You monetize the fixed assets that you actually have in the ground. Maybe you’re less dependent on the transfer portal because you actually are, like, raising up your own talent. 

You generate real money. Some of these schools raise a lot of money, like football and basketball. Women’s golf doesn’t raise that much money. A couple hundred thousand dollars recurring in fees because you have a JV squad, which I know you can’t use that term, but you have a D2 squad or you have a second team, whatever you wanna actually call them, I think is a real opportunity for athletic departments. 

And no one’s really thinking about it. There are a few schools out there, like High Point, moved their club sports division under their athletic department I believe- Vanderbilt did that at one point, didn’t they? I believe, has actually done something similar. And so these are all things that if you put the right person in the seat at the athletic [00:34:00] department, they’ll start thinking about these. 

There are real ways to generate revenue from the commercialization stan- standpoint that you’re so focused on and that you guys are so good on. But there’s also a lot of ways to generate money from participation. IMG doesn’t have any TV revenue, AJ. Zero. Yeah. Zero ticket sales, zero concessions. How can they sell for $1.2 billion? 

AJ Maestas: I feel like you were just telling me they have a plan to create academies at universities. I’m just joking. 

Drew Weatherford: But no, the academy model- Isn’t that interesting, though? They don’t have- yeah … any of– 60% of the revenue that college athletic departments get are non-existent at IMG Academy. 

More than 60, ’cause there’s no don- there’s no donations. There’s no donations either, right? But they’re able to be wildly profitable just through participation. Maybe that’s an idea for some athletic departments to think about. 

AJ Maestas: Are you familiar with some of the independent academies, so not attached to an international football club, but we have a new potential client we’re working with that’s gonna replicate something [00:35:00] they, they built in Africa, that’s concentrating on four major sports. 

Drew Weatherford: Yeah. 

AJ Maestas: Look around the world and find untapped potential for talent and, the willingness for people to sponsor kids in there and, you know, the funnel of talent and. 

Drew Weatherford: I agree. I agree. 

AJ Maestas: So if IMG Academy is worth $1.2 billion and it has 1,600 athletes, what is– We’ll stop using Florida State as an example. What is a major Big Ten or SEC athletic department worth? 

Drew Weatherford: They’re all north of a billion dollars. 

AJ Maestas: Yeah. Yeah. And how is this gonna happen? I know this is the core of some investments you’re about to make, so what does it look like? 

Drew Weatherford: The way we’re investing, I would view it as bridge capital, right? Just to be clear, we’re not taking equity in any of the universities or any of the opportunities that we’re looking at currently. 

I do think that’s likely going to be opportuni- opportunities in the future to do. Our financial instrument [00:36:00] today is no different than, going to a bank and getting a loan. It’s just way more flexible and way more long-term than a traditional loan would be. I am of the opinion that legal issues are going to continue to plague college athletics. 

I’m not certain that they’re gonna get anything done in DC. I think it’s 50/50. If Congress ends, ends up, giving them protection, this could perpetuate. If they don’t, the legal liability is gonna be pretty significant for these universities And I think there’s a greater likelihood for things to reorganize and for universities to privatize or maybe even leagues privatize and separate themselves from the NCAA if Congress doesn’t help in some way, shape, or form. 

AJ Maestas: What are you rooting for, by the way, on that? You’d like to see that bi- that, executive order become law, [00:37:00] or would you prefer antitrust protection for the NCAA and they get to keep administering? 

Drew Weatherford: You know what I really hope for most is what’s best for the ninety-eight percent of athletes that are not football and basketball players. 

Whatever helps conferences reorganize themselves to rationally make sense so that amateur athletics, which is what college sports is supposed to be, can actually operate like amateur athletics. I would make my decision based off of that. What is going to get college athletics back to what it really is supposed to be for the ninety-eight percent of student athletes that aren’t football and basketball players. 

I’m willing to be convinced otherwise. I think that means the best thing to happen is for football and basketball to separate and to reorganize itself outside of the existing conference, outside of the NCAA, [00:38:00] so that it would allow the conferences to reorganize themselves geographically. 

So you don’t have someone running track at Rutgers flying to Oregon to run for ten seconds and then flying all over. So I think that’s what’s most important. Right now what I think is unfortunate, even being a football player, is all the time and attention is being spent on the two percent. 

It’s like, how do we fix this? How do we optimize for this? And as much as I want and believe these guys should get paid, I also think they should be employees because they are employees. They’re being worked like employees. They’re being treated like employees. Let’s stop fooling ourselves. But none of that can happen unless they separate. 

So my hope is after we get done figuring out how to deal with the house settlement, we start paying attention to the other ninety-eight [00:39:00] percent of student athletes again and do what’s in their best interest as well. And I think both can coexist. But right now that’s the best solution I can think of, is to have football and basketball reorganize themselves. 

AJ Maestas: The geography thing is pretty ridiculous, and the travel, it’s pretty taxing on students and, and athletes, right? People don’t travel three time zones and, thrive. 

Drew Weatherford: So- I think the biggest selling point to all of it, AJ, is It would fix the transfer portal, which is what everyone hates about college athletics. 

If you talk to 10 people, nine of them talk about NIL and the transfer portal as the exact same thing. It’s really fascinating. They’re like, “I hate NIL.” And you’re like, “No you don’t. You hate the transfer portal. You’re just…” Like when you actually peel it back, and it’s like if they were employees, they wouldn’t be able to be… 

They’d be treated like employees, right? They- Yeah … we wouldn’t be going into the portal and getting 40 new guys every year. I think that would help fandom. I really do. I [00:40:00] think that would help the student athletes. I believe they would wanna be treated like that, and things would be better off for them if they were treated like that. 

AJ Maestas: Yeah. Yeah. But it doesn’t seem the solution’s gonna come from… what’s the what’s the new transfer window? It’s January, so now football coaches, as if they don’t have enough going on in January, December, they’re gonna be managing their roster and transfer portal and high school age recruiting and a bowl game. 

And I guess it’s to align with semesters, which of course makes sense from the academic side. But yeah, it’s not getting there on its own, so- 

Drew Weatherford: These are all the symptoms. They’re not the root problem. And- like we keep on treating the symptoms, and I’m not naive. This is not simple to fix. 

But the root problem is not being addressed with any of this stuff, and I think it needs to at some point in time. 

AJ Maestas: Let me wrap up with a couple rapid fire questions. Yeah. Can I? These will be fun. What is one game memory at Florida State that you will never forget? 

Drew Weatherford: It’s Boston College [00:41:00] 2007. Boston College had just beat Virginia Tech, like last second throw. They were ranked number two in the country, and, obviously Matt Ryan was a great quarterback. Incredible challenge, and it was probably the best game of my career. Most, clean game that I played, and so I think that was my most fond memory from a performance standpoint. 

The other one would be we won the ACC Championship my red shirt freshman year, which was really special, and we were big underdogs against Virginia Tech in that game, and, came out with the dub. 

AJ Maestas: Favorite school to play on the road during your time at Florida State? 

Drew Weatherford: That’s tough. You know what’s funny is my favorite places to play, I got my ass kicked in. 

I loved- That doesn’t make sense … I loved going to The Swamp. Okay. It’s an incredible, environment. Had a lot of friends that went to school there, so that was always really fun. But got smoked when we were there. Those were their best years. That [00:42:00] was when kinda the, their two national championship years. 

And then Clemson’s a pretty incredible environment and, and we had a hard time, we had a hard time there. But I think the one, if I could pick one that was like the moment that I was the most excited in any stadium, it’s Virginia Tech. Hokie Sandman, when they’re running out onto the field is pretty incredible. 

Actually, that, that- it would be the one moment that I think I was the most excited to play football in my life was when that took place. 

AJ Maestas: That’s cool. That’s very cool. I like hearing that. Good. We’ll pass that on to our friends at Virginia Tech. All right. Greatest piece of advice you received from Bobby Bowden. 

Drew Weatherford: He had a different way of saying this, but it’s very similar to what Coach Saban would say often. He had a different way of articulating it, but it’s basically to be process-oriented, not outcome-oriented. And that is just, whether it’s in life or whether it’s in sports, [00:43:00] is to wake up every day and to do the little things well, and to take pride in practice and in your fundamentals, and to not look at the scoreboard, I think is the greatest piece of advice. 

AJ Maestas: I like that. I’m a fan of that, too. Very much. Do you have a personal hack on health and wellness, just leading a balanced life that you’ll share with us? 

Drew Weatherford: I wake up at 4:30 AM, and I’m working out at 5:00 with a big group of people. Actually, believe it or not, AJ, at my house. So there’s twenty five people that come to my house every morning at 5:00. And so I feel fortunate to be able to have a situation where I can do that. But having a gym in your house and having the accountability of people showing up, whether you’re there or whether you’re not. 

AJ Maestas: Yeah, that is, that’s a good- Will help you quite a bit. That’s a good commitment device. Yeah. There’s, they’re getting around. 

Drew Weatherford: No doubt. 

AJ Maestas: All right. Last question I promise here. What are you most excited for in the next year? 

Drew Weatherford: I’m [00:44:00] excited to see if we can get one of these college deals done. 

AJ Maestas: Oh, yeah, you will. Don’t, don’t you think you will? 

Drew Weatherford: I really do. I really do. Yeah. I’m feeling very optimistic that we will get something done. So if that would be– if that comes to fruition, to be the first group to find a way to put private capital into college athletics in this way would be pretty special, considering how much time, energy, and effort we’ve put into it. And also, to be the first at doing anything is always pretty fun and unique. I know you will. 

AJ Maestas: I know you’ve already been incredibly close, and let’s be honest, it’s a matter of, when, not if. But, but much like college athletics, much like our entire discussion today, there’s a lot of people who’d like to be early, no one who wants to be first. 

So the dominoes will fall. The dominoes will fall. For everybody listening, if you have any questions or comments, reach out to us anytime. My email is AJ@NVGT.com, and, you can get us on my LinkedIn page or the Navigate LinkedIn page. But, again, this is AJ Maestas [00:45:00] with Navigate, joined by Drew Weatherford, and, thank you for joining us on Navigating Sports Business. 

Drew Weatherford: Thanks, AJ. That was fun.